peta's ingrid newkirk speaks out in forbes
In a recent interview with Forbes.com, PETA's Ingrid Newkirk spoke frankly about the issues and challenges facing animal rights groups today. She also highlighted some recent stories in the media that have been helping our cause and gave a friendly shout out to The Kind Diet!
Here's the full interview:
PETA's Ingrid Newkirk - A Conversation with Michael Tobias
Michael Tobias (MT): What is the most pressing problem that animal rights groups like PETA face today?
Ingrid Newkirk (IN): That's a bit like asking which shoes pinch the most. It's got to be what people eat, simply because, while not everyone wears fur or experiments on animals, everyone eats. That means a mind-boggling number of animals suffer for the palate. And the cruelty isn't just in daft and cruel killings. It's the casual cruelty of the lunchtime sandwich or the evening meal. This is not to say that dietary habits aren't changing. Putting aside the New Jersey woman who is vying to be the fattest person on the planet, we see cookbooks like Alicia Silverstone's The Kind Diet and programs like Dr. Neal Barnard's 21- Day Weight Loss Kick Start become bestsellers right out of the gate. But, in America alone, human beings breed, raise, transport, and then slaughter more than 16 billion land animals every 365 days. That doesn't even count fish and crabs, who aren't inanimate objects, no matter how hard it may be for us to relate to them.
MT: Indeed, in the marine and riparian realms recent data suggests "0.97 - 2.7 trillion" wild fish are caught and killed by humans. That said, how do you respond to criticism that PETA is pushing the vegan agenda too aggressively?
IN: Let's get graphic for a moment, as I hate this namby-pamby, cowardly business of "Don't show me what animals go through-I like my steak." We are talking about an enormous number of individual pigs having bits of their ears cut out with a hole punch for identification purposes, chickens having their beaks seared off with a hot wire, cows having their horns removed with a pair of tongs; animals being thrown into crates, kicked, and prodded up ramps into something they've never seen before, a truck, and ending up, eyes wide with fear, in a place where they see others right before them being strung up and having their throats slit. Fish are slit open on board ships after being hauled up, suffocating, with their eyes bulging out of their heads from decompression and their gills torn in the nets. Eating animals and stealing what's theirs, like the milk meant for their calves, is aggression. Pointing out what such behavior means to animals is education. There's no way to make it sound pretty.
MT: What one thing would you ban?
IN: Supremacism! That's like racism and sexism-the idea that others are less than you in intellect or table manners or looks and that therefore that gives you carte blanche to manipulate, use, abuse, and slaughter them as you like. It's self-serving, ignorant malarkey.
MT: Animal stories are constantly in the news. Which ones do you think have been helpful to PETA, if any?
IN: You'd have to live in a cave to have missed the Michael Vick trial-that has at least put dogfighting, the silent blood sport, on the map in this country. And the story about the chimpanzee who tore a woman's face off has made some legislators think about a ban on wild animals, who get so frustrated in captivity that they go berserk. When newspapers ran the whistleblower photos of how the circus trains baby elephants with beatings and tie-downs, that woke a lot of people up-so much so that almost 1,000 people showed up in Los Angeles to protest when the beast wagons rolled into town. PETA's 'silly' stunts get ink and air time. Like our beating Michelle Bachmann to the punch by bringing back two dollar a gallon gas first. We paid the extra pump cost and served up Tofurkey sandwiches to motorists, and it allowed us to make the point that you can do more to reduce your carbon footprint by going vegan than you can by driving a hybrid car. Our 'sexy' ads get a lot of play, and while people might laugh at them, they also look at them, and they come to PETA.org to watch the sexy videos but go away the wiser for it.
MT: What do you think makes humans ignore some cruelties?
IN: At PETA, we often say that the issue of how animals are treated isn't just about them; it's about us, how we behave. It is about what we are thinking when we do violent things to others whom we find it difficult to relate to or whom we dismiss as too unimportant to take into consideration at all. A lot of people have culturally induced ethical blindness, but they can be cured! A lot of people profess to holding religion dear. One of the main tenets of Buddhism is that -all lives are equal. Confucianism teaches us that -we shall treat everything in the world as one. Jesus talked of being kind even to the "least of them," of watching out for the smallest sparrow. Judaism and Islam have wonderful teachings about kindness to animals as a prime virtue. Whether or not we are religious, respecting others should be seen as just as important as looking out for ourselves, yet it requires discipline to change our bad habits that cause pain to animals. I think that the more we learn about animals, the harder it is to abuse them. For instance, that the average dog in a human family learns hundreds of household words without being taught them. Ants build boats to cross streams. Bats take food to nearby bats who are sick. Chimpanzees, crows, elephants, and even fish use tools. Octopuses learn how to open a jar simply by watching a person do it. Elephants cradle their dead relatives' bones in their trunks, tears pouring down their faces. Little desert rats collect dew by rolling a stone in front of their burrow. Geese and pigeons mate for life, mourn, and become demonstrably depressed if a mate dies. All these things and many others have been measured, witnessed, studied, and published.
MT: People must ask you "Aren't there more important causes?"
IN: That's a sort of "As long as I'm all right, Jack" attitude. When Martin Luther King Jr. protested U.S. involvement in the Vietnam War, his followers admonished him and said that he should stay out of it, that it didn't directly involve civil rights. Dr. King replied, "Injustice anywhere is a threat to justice everywhere." I don't subscribe to the idea that we must look after men or whites or Americans or whomever we most closely identify with first, and then and only then can we help others. Our compassion is big enough to let us look beyond the identity of the victim to the injustice and object to that. To me, it is one world, and the non-human animals bear the brunt of oppression and suffering.
MT: What position do you take on the upcoming elections?
IN: PETA can't electioneer, but we can ask every candidate to improve the health of this country, which is down the drain, by abandoning meat and dairy subsidies; supporting laws that would require assistance for military personnel relocating from overseas and disaster area evacuees so that they can take their beloved animals with them; stopping Department of Defense training exercises that hurt animals in terrible ways and that can easily be replaced by more sophisticated teaching methods; and enforcing the Animal Welfare Act against traveling shows that are dragging arthritic, lame elephants around in shackles. Anyone who agrees should be writing to their representatives and the candidates. Oh, and, please, Mr. Obama, choose a veggie burger or a veggie dog when you pop into your favorite Washington fast-food joint! PETA has made sure that they stock them!
For a recent three-hour filmed discussion with Ms. Ingrid Newkirk, in addition to several other prominent scientists and social scientists, see "State of the Earth," viewable as 12 YouTube videos; or as three one-hour down-loadable videos, or obtainable in one boxed set.
Copyright Dancing Star Foundation
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What do you think are the greatest challenges are to the animal rights movement today?
26 comments
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I have to correct her on her comment about what Jesus said. The verse refers to treatment of people, not animals. The verse actually says "The King will reply, 'Truly I tell you, whatever you did for one of the least of these brothers and sisters of mine, you did for me.' It is Matthew 25:40 and reading the entire passage will further clarify the context.
I am not saying having compassion for animals is incompatible with Christianty. I care greatly about animals and don't want them to suffer either. As a Christian, however, I cannot ignore when my Savior and King's words are twisted or misquoted. God bless!
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I totally agree with Erin. PETA plays a valuable role in our society. I just wish people would understand what PETA is trying accomplish here-- and that is to make people aware of what is actually going on behind the scenes, (because our animal friends cannot speak for themselves)..everyone needs to speak out, and to educate those who aren't aware of the cruelties and the injustice our animals face each day of their short lives. I know that personally, I will never be at peace until there is an end to this suffering.
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Good interview but until PETA discontinues its encouragement of euthanizing pit bulls, I will not be a supporter. I realize I'm just one person, but this one person will never send them any donations.
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I support PETA's mission, but not the way they go about it. For me, the exploitation of animals AND people is wrong. Objectifying people (let's get real, primarily women) sexually in order to stop the exploitation and objectification of animals defeats what should be the purpose of the animals rights and animal welfare movements: compassion and respect for all living creatures. I am a vegan feminist/feminist vegan, and for me, these issues go hand and hand. For this reason, I distance myself from PETA and their activities and find it completely insulting to have Ingrid downplay the messages that are sent when sex is used to get attention, even on behalf of animals. Aren't we better than that?? Erin www.eatplantsandrun.com
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I have read through the sites that Andrea suggested and I applaud anyone who has been able to establish a no kill shelter in their area, as that is the gold standard that we all would love to see come to fruition in our areas as well. However, I have never seen a shelter that is able to staff enough people to make this happen. I understand that volunteers are the lifeblood of an organization, as I work for a wildlife rehab that runs on volunteers and only a few staff. However, some of Nathan Winograd's requirements for a no-kill shelter would require trained staff or volunteers to be available constantly for every person that walks in the door. Most volunteers also work full-time jobs (as I did when I started as a volunteer and still do as part-time staff) and can only commit to a few hours a week. Thus, the organization would need to take extensive time to train a lot of volunteers on subjects such as counseling owners on how to deal with pet behavior or medical problems. Also, vet bills are expensive. Many vets still charge organizations (I know ours does) but at a reduced rate, however for an organization that runs on donations this is still sometimes too much when there are so many animals in need. Rescue groups and foster care are excellent choices and I think have helped shelters greatly. One last point is that I do not agree with free-roaming cats. I do not agree with trap-neuter-release because cats are introduced predators to our area. These cats account for a crazy amount of deaths of wildlife in our country. I can't tell you how many animals have been brought in to our rehab after being caught by a cat. If not immediately killed, they will die from bacterial infection without antibiotic treatment. Cats should stay inside and can live a long healthy life indoors.
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I support PETA wholeheartedly. Trying to get an apathetic public to take more than two seconds out of their lives to pay attention is an exceedingly difficult task -- especially when you're calling deeply entrenched habits in question. People don't want to know that the chicken or cow they ate lived and died and suffered terribly, they don't want to be bothered looking for an oven cleaner that wasn't dripped into the eyes of immobilized rabbits, they still think intelligent and aware chimpanzees can be infected with AIDS ... PETA demands that people sit up and take notice. To think. To debate. To change hearts and minds. Animals are suffering in unthinkable ways, and all this outrage is focused towards PETA instead of animal abusers? Instead of an honest self-examination?
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I run a rescue and I can tell you that no group is perfect in this industry. We all do our best and sometimes we do things that people or other groups don't agree with. I think the most important thing here is that the more people and rescue groups and animal agencies that speak out and get the word out about our lovely animals that we share this world with...the better! It doesn't help the animals if we spend time picking apart other groups and how they do things. All we can do is our best and take the cause one animal at a time. We need to lift each other up and stand together. I may not believe in some of the PETA ways....but they do get great publicity and that spreads the word and educates the public on these very important issues!!!
I think that we all need to remind society of this one thing.......If there were no demand then there would be NO supply. It is not Peta that we need to attack or any other group because they are not the people funding puppy mills, cow farms, or the mink industry. WE are the issue and rescue groups would not have a job if humans would be better stewards of the earth and the animals that we share it with.
Don't hate the porn industry....hate the person purchasing the video;-)
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Thank you for reposting Ingrid Newkirk's thought-provoking interview, Alicia, and for promoting compassion yourself.
Ingrid and PETA are on the front lines helping animals everyday--doing the dirty work and going undercover to expose cruelty--and I am so informed by visiting their website. They have a fun, and yes, sometimes in your face style, but they always get you to think and act, and they always go to bat for animals.
While it would be nice to live in a fairytale land and believe that there are good homes for all of the dogs/cats out there that need one, that is simply not the case. Over 4 million are euthanized every year because of it. Spaying and neutering is the way to go and never buy from a pet store or a breeder--all things PETA advocates. And make sure the companion animal you bring into your home is your friend for life--don't dump it at a shelter when you're tired of it (it'll join the 8 million other pets who share the same fate every year).
Kudos to Ingrid for telling it like it is and for being so courageous! She makes me proud to be a vegan--and so do you, Alicia!
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I think the misunderstandings that are being spread about PETA are either done so by those who stand to profit from animal exploitation or by those who who'd rather believe inaccuracies so as not to be forced to look at the issues and do something about them. How silly to believe, if you have any logical side to your thinking, that PETA, an animal rights organization, would kill animals just for the helluv it. Just look at PETA's website about companion animal issues (http://www.peta.org/issues/companion-animals/default.aspx)- where you'll find info on spaying & neutering, stopping dog fighting, and cruelty case investigations (to name but a few)- and it's pretty hard to deny that the group's intentions are simply to erradicate animal abuse, neglect, and suffering. Also, we're all on here because we support Alicia, and I don't think that she would associate herself in any way, shape, or form with an animal rights group that is anything but legitimate. Regardless, I thought the article about Ingrid was very interesting, and she seems like an exceptionally smart and educated woman on the issues she's been fighting for her whole life (go figure!). I just learned that the org just had its 30th anniversary and there was mention of the investigation that made PETA a household name- one which I had forgotten about: the Silver Spring Monkeys: http://origin.www.peta.org/issues/animals-used-for-experimentation/the-silver-spring-monkeys.aspx. If it weren't for PETA, the animal rights movement wouldn't be where it is today (forinstance, folks wouldn't be spreading lies or shaking in their boots at the thought of changing their carefree lifestyles). I certainly wouldn't have gone veg when I did.
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As a longtime open-admission shelter volunteer, I support PETA and the caring shelters across the country that have no choice but to euthanize animals for lack of homes. We all want an end to euthanasia, but turning animals away when there is no more room or warehousing animals in cages for years, as many "no-kill" shelters do, aren't humane options. Many shelters that have tried to become no-kill have quickly ended up overwhelmed, keeping animals in overcrowded, inhumane conditions. It happened just recently at a Baton Rouge shelter, where animals were crammed up to eight to a cage. This is just one of many examples of how the "no-kill equation" equals suffering for animals.
Unlike no-kill shelters, PETA doesn't just accept the cutest and most adoptable animals and turn the rest away. It takes in the animals no one else wants--in many cases, they are horribly injured, sick, suffering, and aggressive. A peaceful, painless release is beyond a doubt the kindest option for many of the poor souls PETA rescues
People who are upset about the need for euthanasia should direct their anger at those who create the need to do so in the first place: breeders, pet stores, and people who don't spay or neuter their animals. No-kill shelters aren't the solution to animal homelessness. Spaying and neutering and adopting animals from shelters instead of buying them from breeders and pet stores are.
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I'm not going to say that I am for or against PETA... I think they have wonderful vegetarian starter kits and recipes and mean well in terms of trying to get people to follow a plant-based diet. However, I do not support their tactics, they seem downright scary!
Watch this Pen and Teller episode to the end and they go into some of the shadiness behind PETA... being scared of health concerns is a great reason to go vegan but being scared that the organization is going to blow up a laboratory... yeesh! As a long-time vegetarian and vegan, I think the best way to spread veganism is by living a kind life and feeling your best :) That way, everybody is happy. And then when people ask "what's your secret?" you can answer "I'm a vegan!" Here's the episode if you're interested, it's pretty interesting...
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Awesome interview! I have great respect for Ingrid. She has the courage to tell it like it is, and also for PETA; they do the tough stuff that most of us won't. About dog and cat homelessness...it's a real problem and PETA is working to fix it in the only effective and logical ways possible. The "no-kill" advocates are delusional if they think there's a good home for the millions of homeless animals. They're a misguided bunch, those slow-killers. Good work, Ms. Newkirk. Count me as a fan of Alicia's and of PETA.
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I second that Timothy Tang!
As a omni, I never had any respect for PETA because of their (imo) over the top antics.
As a vegan, I look at the things PETA does to get in the news and I am embarrassed to be associated. Like it or not, PETA represents (and i would say misrepresents) us in the eyes of many omnis.
I believe compassionate, gentle communication will do more to educate others than throwing red paint on fur store windows.
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* eeks, i intended so state that, most noteworthy, i love my life after bulimia with gwendolyn, aided by alicia's website. i am most forever grateful to gwendolyn . . . and to alica. :) major typographical error on that one! please forgive me! :) xo ~ http://www.nicoleandgwendolyn.com
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ugh! loved reading this! so many people claim that PETA is too liberal. i don't think that "liberal enough" can ever be achieved! i come from 11 years of disordered eating, specifically of bulimia. my sweet dog, gwendolyn, saved my life from it. during an episode that hurt gwendolyn, i pinky swore to her paw that i would never be bulimic again, and i've kept that promise for over one year. SO, in addition to giving gwendolyn one fabulous adventure each and everyday AND blogging about it, i have established my life rule to NOT consume any animal or product from an animal with which i can cuddle. they just remind me too much of my sweet little princess. please visit my blog if you wish to reach about gwendolyn's adventures and of my life after bulimia! i love PETA, i love life after bulimia . . . and, most noteworthy, i love my life after bulimia (one year, two months, and 11 days) . . . http://www.nicoleandgwendolyn.com.
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Since 1998, PETA has killed over 20,000 animals. Over one year ago, I wrote a blog opining that the reason PETA slaughters virtually every animal it seeks out and "impounds" has more to do with Ingrid Newkirk's dark impulses than with any ideology, philosophy, or belief in overpopulation. This followed a staggering 97% kill rate for animals in 2006, despite millions of animal loving members, a world-wide reach, and a budget of tens of millions of dollars. It followed the killing of 1,942 out of 1,960 cats they impounded. It followed the deaths of 988 out of the 1,030 dogs they impounded. It followed the killing of 50 of the 52 rabbits, guinea pigs, and other animals they took in. It followed the killing of the one and only chicken they impounded. That blog earned me a letter from PETA's attorney threatening litigation for defamation.
Then came the 2007 numbers showing a 91% rate of killing--the killing of 1,815 of the 1,997 animals they impounded. And so I reran the blog. And now we have the 2008 figures and the slaughter--the needless, senseless, evil slaughter--continues with an equally staggering 96% kill rate. A paltry seven dogs and cats were adopted. A paltry 34 were transferred to an SPCA whose fates are not known. And out of 2,216 dogs and cats impounded, the rest were systematically put to death by PETA.
Killed: 555 of the 584 dogs.
Killed: 1,569 of the 1,589 cats.
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Catconserv: you are buying into the idea of pet overpopulation. There is NOT A pet overpopulation problem, there is a shelter managerial problem in the US. You are misinformed. Do a little research, read NAthan Winograd's books, follow the No Kill solution. Overnight shelters save 90% of animals, by simply following 10 procedures and policy changes with NEW SHELTER DIRECTORS.
Carolina: I'm sorry but you're flat out wrong. No, I'm not talking about it as if they are doing it to stop an animals suffering. They do it as an ideological belief that they are "better off dead". They do not give them a chance to find a home and live. PETA has an ideological problem and people NEED TO wake up and see them for what they are.
Want some truth in your life? http://www.nathanwinograd.com/
Read about how lovely this woman is here: http://www.nathanwinograd.com/?p=907
nathan Winograd is the only person that I know of, that is truly offering solutions on how to STOP THE MURDER and SAVE THE ANIMALS. Read up animal lovers.
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I am very shocked by the fact that this discussion revolves around something that is quite obvious. Carolina and Madison have said said it really well.
The issue here, and what we should be talking, is about animal rights. That said, I think Ingrid Newkirk knows pretty well what she says and her ideas seem quite well developed and well thought.
I think we need compassion and empathy in order to change the rules.
We need to show our kids that animals are living beings who feel, like us. Who could hurt someone when they understand this?
I trust in people like Alicia, big hearts always win, always.
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catconsrv, I agree with you completely! No activist group is perfect, and they work with what they have and do what they can do, considering the situation of our cruel world. To say that they are SICK because of it is just a really radical and ignorant statement.
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Andrea,
You're talking about euthanization as if they do it for fun! When they do use it, it's for the purpose of STOPPING an animal's suffering. Between living with pain so excruciating that it I'd be left practically immobilized,and leaving this world peacefully, I'd choose the latter! And that's why they do it, because it's better than leaving an animal to die slowly and horribly in pain. You can't just make claims that what they do is evil if you're not looking at the bigger picture and WHY they do it...
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I read somewhere that peta has euthanized about 22,000 animals since they have begun. In reality, that is not that many. I believe that they must have had reasons to do so (overpopulation, illness, etc.). I know that they have done some things that some may call extreme but in general I do feel as though that they are looking out for animals best interests.
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Andrea, like many shelters I'm sure PETA euthanizes animals because of overpopulation. There are not enough people looking for cats and dogs, especially cats, to take the load of them. Also, everyone wants a kitten or a puppy, meaning the older animals are left to rot in the shelters. I don't agree with this and think that older animals or abused animals can still make good pets, however overpopulation is obvious. I love animals more than words can express, but I recognize that there is a problem. Shelters do the best that they can but do not have enough money or space for all of the animals for years (if that's what it takes to get them adopted). As more animals come in, the money gets thinner and thinner which means less care for each animal. I am not some hard core PETA activist, but I understand why shelters must euthanize these days. It is literally impossible to find a shelter that will accept a cat where I live because they are all overwhelmed.
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Alicia,
As an animal rescuer who is VERY familiar with the national organizations, I'd like to say flat out that PETA is a very decietful organization and most people are VERY confused about them. While they may speak out and advocate for not wearing fur and other wildlife saving, they kill, murder and "euthanize" 90% of the animals they "rescue" they also have a flat out view that pit bulls and shelter animals are "better off dead" than sitting in a shelter or "potentially ending up in the hands of hoarders or dog fighters". This woman is very SICK...and NO ONE, i MEAN NO ONE should support PETA. They advocate for killing animals, believe it or not.
If you need proof, there's plenty. I am a highly educated college graduate, owner of two successful businesses. I'm not a kook or a nutter, not off my rocker. This is fact. People need to do more research and advocating for PETA is not in shelter animals highest interest, it's likely to spread more misinformation and kill more animals.
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